INTERVIEW BY SEAN OCEAN
Building the Detroit scene can be described as a brick-by-brick process. You can think of the Detroit underground as a historic cathedral; while the city’s pioneers laid the grand foundation, it is the custodial artists who have spent the last two decades meticulously restoring the stained glass and maintaining the structure so that the music can continue to resonate with integrity through its halls. In this interview, we trace Dan Bain and Mister Joshooa‘s influence and their evolution from the late 90s underground to their roles as modern caretakers of the Detroit scene.
Dan, you entered the scene in 1999 during the visceral era of late 90s techno parties. Josh, you arrived in 2000 when downtown was largely boarded up but full of artistic potential. How did that specific era of urban decay and DIY energy foster your brick by brick philosophy toward building a career and a community?
Dan Bain: I was introduced to the late 90’s rave scene attending parties that were integrating hip-hop acts (now legends) like the GZA, ODB, the RZA with techno and house DJs. I was introduced to Eminem by watching him throw down at a rave, before I ever listened to his music. Booked around these acts was a host of solid regional techno and house DJs. This blend of distinctly different styles and cultures imprinted on me deeply at the time, no doubt influences the range I like to integrate in my sets whenever possible. The added magic of the anarchic and improvisational nature of these shows was another critical influence. Transforming a basically abandoned warehouse into a place where this connective magic could happen was incredible. The secret was always the sound system. By this time these parties had become highly competitive already and whoever had the biggest rig or the wildest lineup could win the day. My first DJ gig was landed by randomly calling an info-line and leaving a pitch to play. I was stunned to get a call back and an offer to warm up the rig when the doors opened. The biggest takeaway for me was the concept of turning an unconventional space into something incredible.
Mister Joshooa: So the city being in decay with very few club options left only one choice for an outsider like me, and that is to build something of my own. I have to admit I was taken aback with my first experiences of warehouse parties back then. To me it seemed like massaged anarchy. I couldn’t discern what in the fuck was actually going on. But I loved it no doubt so I kept going back for more, paying attention and taking notes . I was starting from zero. But as my knowledge of the scene grew and my DJ skills matured I knew I had to create something for myself and others like me; the misfits and newbies. It wasn’t exactly easy to be accepted back then, you sort of had to prove that your intentions were pure and you were not just some transient looking to capitalize on this thing everyone held so dearly in their hearts . I know this because I do the same thing now, protect the scene I helped build and maintain. But yeah, DIY was the only option back then and I think it needs to come back to that now more than ever. But shit in one hand and wish in the other you know? I can’t help but feel that those days are lost forever, unless we can figure out a way to completely destroy social media.
You both operate under the simple maxim that there is only “good music and bad music”. When you two perform together for your Pulse Width series, how do you bridge the gap between Dan’s soulful and ethereal house and Josh’s raw, acid tinged techno sounds? Where do you take the set when it could go anywhere?
MJ:That’s a very good question, and I don’t know if I have an easy answer. Me and Dan have put enough hours in together to know each other pretty well. We don’t talk about what we are gonna do, there is no plan. It comes down to being able to read each other and the room. You have to be able to pick up on all the energy nuances and respond accordingly . Also if there is one thing that bores me it’s hearing a set that doesn’t diverge from a single genre. A safe set if you will. There is a lot of magic that goes down when you are taking chances with mixes. It doesn’t always work out but when it does i tell you what, its fucking awesome. So I guess we just have patience and understanding for ourselves and one another. Respect goes a long way in this game we play together .
DB: ^^^ excellent response from Josh here.
I think the first time we did a proper B2B was a spontaneous sunrise jam at EFUNK, completely off the schedule and unplanned. We had been hanging together enough over the years at TV Lounge to fully trust each other at that moment and the result was a set people still talk about. Josh’s steady groove and countless hours on TV over the years made me feel supremely comfortable to experiment a bit, knowing he has the capacity to reel things back to life dance-floor energy with little effort. Since then we have been together a lot and every time feels like another exploration in the unknown with unwavering confidence that it will be incredible.
Josh, you are known for a minimalist, vinyl only approach using just two turntables and a mixer. Dan, you have curated a library of over 1,500 pieces of vinyl. In an age of digital convenience, why is the physical risk of playing wax still the most vital tool for true improvisation?
MJ: I won’t get into which format is better, digital or vinyl, however after 20+ years spinning wax I have learned a thing or 2. What makes vinyl special to me is that it is risky. The higher the risk, the higher the reward right? When you put on a record you are committing to it, there is no loop or cue button, no pitch correction. So you’re stuck with it , which forces you to be creative in the mix. This is where the “magic” lives. Forcing yourself to be creative while doing something difficult can really sharpen your artistic imagination. And at this point, my imagination knife is really fucking sharpe. Some say I could circumcise a gnat.
DB: I had a formative moment playing an AYLI show more than a decade ago at 222 Hyde. My digital setup failed, but I had brought 50 pieces of wax with me. The result was an incredible pivot from everything I thought I would do and came straight from the heart. It was a special night for me. Since then, regardless of digital advances I always bring a stack of records for a show out of town. There is something so effortless about playing the timeless records I know inside and out in a fresh context for a new audience.
You have both been described as the institutional backbone of Detroit. Josh, you spent 20 years developing TV Lounge amp by amp, and Dan, you’ve been a Paxahau resident and inner circle member since 2006. How has the transition from volunteer to stage leader changed your perspective on the hustle?
DB: When Paxahau took control of Movement in 2006, I saw an opportunity to pour the passion I have for this music and community into a project where I could make maximum impact. I went as hard as I could year one as a volunteer and earned a rare referral to Paxahau management at the end of the weekend to bring me on in a long term capacity. After spending close to two years on street promo hitting every party, every weekend I had met a lot of really cool people and began to fully understand how the scene was functioning at that time. Ironically, the hallmark minimal techno sound of that time started to feel a bit uninspiring for me. This was around the time I met Eli & Charlie from Soul Clap and suddenly felt empowered to play what I wanted to play again. The way these guys blended so many genres and influences resonated with me on a cellular level. I started leaning into this style of performance as often as I could. Music aside, seeing the way Paxahau managed production was such an incredible life lesson. The core team was all focused on their niche specialty and did it extremely well. I brought this concept to Houston with me 2013 to help me build and develop a crew and a venue to bring the Detroit energy to a new market.
MJ: Well it has changed my perspective in a way that I couldn’t have anticipated but am very grateful for. I went from being a player to a coach . And although I still play the game, I will always have those custodial eyes. When I walk into a party I size up everything, looking for slack in the line. I can’t help it, my mind goes right there. If I feel like I can assist in any way, I’m gonna try. I have to stop myself sometimes because it’s not my place but hey, i yam what i yam.
Dan, you are a specialist in marathon sets that can last up to seven hours. Josh, you prefer a largely improvised style where you never pre-select a set. How do these different ways of managing time and energy on the dance floor allow you to reach that dancer who needs the music most? Is there any specific philosophy behind that?
DB: When I got the call to play an 8 hour set to warm up a room at Lincoln Factory for a VISIONQUEST Movement Party last year – I was ecstatic. This is a dream gig for me. I love having the space to explore an empty room and get dialed in as people start to show up to party. In Texas I got a lot of experience running long patio sets on Tuesdays for several years at my party, The Release. These experiences were so inspiring that The Release became my identity. The way I most prefer to express music, in long-form – to tell a story of my emotional state and create a feedback loop with the people who join me to dance.
MJ: I think my improvised style completely lends itself to the dance floor . If i decided what I was gonna do before I got there then the set would be for me, which is kind of narcissistic . Leaving it open ended means I can tailor my set to the situation in real time. That is if I’ve packed my bag correctly, which doesn’t always happen . But these are the chances you take whilst playing social olympics .
Josh, you co-founded the My Baby label and studio with Eric Ricker (of Ataxia) in 2016. Some sources note your focus on hardware based jams using consoles and drum machines. How does your persistence and studio driven mentality help you maintain an international presence while staying rooted in Detroit?
MJ: To tell you the truth I don’t get out and travel internationally all that often. I’ve gone out on tour a handful of times but it turns out I’m more of a homebody . I like my studio and playing local gigs. I like being home with my girlfriend and our many cats. Plus I work a regular boots on the ground job here and free time is getting more scarce in my middle age . But hey if anybody reading this wants to book me to play somewhere tight I’m all for it.
Josh, you officially retired from your management and music director roles at TV Lounge in early 2024 to focus on your own artistry. After two decades of programming for others, what has been the most liberating aspect of stepping behind the turntables solely as an artist?
MJ: At first I didn’t really notice the difference, it crept in slowly without telling me. However, I can see it pretty clearly now. Now that i don’t have the club standing behind me; steering the course, affecting my judgement, making me feel all cozy inside, comfortable, i can finally be me. No safety nets, don’t have the club to fall back on, it’s all me up there now. It feels pretty great to be honest. Nothing against the club at all, I wouldn’t be who I am without it but it was definitely time to move on, on my own two feet.
The OK Cool party has become something of a Movement weekend mainstay. How do you ensure that these larger scale events remain a close knit affair and ego free, even as you host major international headliners? How do you ensure the vibe stays feeling like a family party when it’s such an internationally acclaimed event?
MJ: Ill tell you how, you don’t book DJs with inflated egos, and if you happen to without knowing, you deflate them real fast. When an agent makes ridiculous demands and sends insane riders you wipe your ass with it and send it back. On top of all that you make sure there is no such thing as VIP, you treat every patron with respect and dignity and you don’t price gouge at the door. If someone walks into your event pissed off because they waited too long or were mistreated at the door and then paid a super high ticket price they are gonna spread that negative energy around the party. You gotta show em what you are about every step of the way. You gotta stay on top of everything at all times. I’ve seen heaps of promoters over the years just disappear as soon as the doors open, not caring about anyone but themselves and the money. Its fuckin’ wack yo
DB: for myself – trying to curate parties in Houston at WAYS, the warehouse venue I established with Ross Kelly – we had an extremely limited budget as we were developing the space. So every booking had to be highly thoughtful and ultimately a close friend or referral who was willing to accept a modest fee for the experience of working in a fresh room built on the most underground / DIY aesthetics. This made for a really special night :)
You’ve both expressed concern about the scene becoming saturated with DJs in every hotel lobby and restaurant. As residents of the city’s most respected venues like the Marble Bar and TV Lounge, how do you keep the independent and proud culture of Detroit from losing its integrity?
MJ: Not sure I have an answer for that right now. I kinda feel like Yoda living out his last days on the swamp planet waiting to die. But maybe , just maybe, Luke will show up one day and reignite the force again. That being said, there is a ton of potential in the new school, they just need a little encouragement and some guidance, which I’m happy to provide to anyone that needs or asks.
DB: I think mentorship is really important. The kids only know what they know – and a lot of it is influenced by the internet / social media. Younger people often tend to think they have it all figured out and don’t need mentorship (I certainly did in my days). So building relationships with the younger generation is incredibly important to pass the torch in a meaningful way.
Looking forward, Josh, you recently released your Settle Down EP on Planet E. If you could define the blueprint for the future for the Detroit underground in just three words, what would they be?
MJ: Un Fuck Withable
DS: it’s the shit
